Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Why even bother? Better toss them to GB for a month or so and call it a LARP.

To be more serious. In my opinion this can be good practice, but… the rpg itself requires specific people ( If you dont want hear sentences such as: „and again you did not take your medicines”). Same goes for boldness (some are shy: „so what do you do? Hitting him with your staff? No? Cast a spell? No? Retreat maybe? No? Drink a potion? No?”). In the end there would be two choices. You are learning englisch by committing an rpg session, or you play a session using not-very-englisch englisch (or the fishes or the fish tank as goes polisch phrase).

There is one more thing. If you dont want to do things in the turtle mode then you need to communicate verbally. This one can be nasty. Chatting with American is easy, chatting with Scot or drunken Irishman is hard, chatting witch Englischman is extreme In difficulty.

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Marcin Barańczak:
Why even bother? Better toss them to GB for a month or so and
call it a LARP.

Well that is the best way to practice if someone has the time and cash. Not everyone does. And the less practice someone has, the more apt they are to lose what they have from regression.

At proficiency-level most people become the "native speaker" in their firms in Poland: translating documents, dealing with foreign business partners, taking business trips, etc. (Sounds like these are modules in a Longman book or activities on the CAE.)

Proficiency-level speakers have no place to practice within Poland unless they hang out with native speakers of course. Repetition of native-speaker-type duties (with nowhere to continually develop) only degrades their language facility over time.

Hey, believe it or not, it happens to some English natives in Poland. They get here; teach the same subjects and vocabulary over and over; and viola: their diction gets narrowed through repetition.

To be more serious. In my opinion this can be good practice, but… the rpg itself requires specific people ( If you dont want
hear sentences such as: „and again you did not take your medicines”).

Yes and no. Yes, you are quite right. No, it does not depend on the people. As the Game Master, I build the world. The world is the honey that attracts the bees.

There are several styles of GMing. Running Hack Master, for example, will not work to practice language. Running a game like a story by George RR Martin will do it.

Using proper game nouns, like "tulip" for example, rather than lots of description with adjectives, adverbs, metaphor and simile will also take away from the practice. A Zelda quest like "bring me a red tulip" is pretty sad indeed when the description is "you see a field of red tulips."

Nouns like stamen, petal, stem, pollen, leaf, vien, and adjectives like sheen, mat, velveteen, deciduous, coniferous, etc are parts of flora and fauna speech. Even a flower can be a challenge to some. In a collaborative setting, such as RPGs create, the participants help each other.

RPGers, stereo-typically speaking, will not catch on to the Role Playing as a learning tool - even though they did role playing in a language classroom by practicing "job interview," "trip to the trtavel agency" or some other mundane action before CAE level.

Sadly many players think of RPGs as akin to imaginary shooter games. This is after my time, when computer programmers made RPGs into something like DOOM. In a GRRM storyline, hack and slash without thinking and the character ends up dead really quick.

Same in a Gibson 2020 "modern" setting. Hell, same IRL today.

As a GM for language practice sessions, my games rarely have such "in your face" life and death confrontations though the world itself has many conflagations going on that can involve players.

Same goes for boldness (some are shy: „so what do
you do? Hitting him with your staff? No? Cast a spell? No? Retreat maybe? No? Drink a potion? No?”). In the end there would be two
choices. You are learning englisch by committing an rpg session,
or you play a session using not-very-englisch englisch (or the
fishes or the fish tank as goes polisch phrase).

Here I would disagree. Give these shy people a mask that deindividuates them and they get comfortable. Likewise, the environment is collaboratively built and co-operatively sustained and not academically competitive.

Playing a game like RPG requires imaginative improvisation and that requires trust between people. If I talked like a retard on the tram full of people, passengers around me would be threatened and feel uncomfortable. To overcome this challenge between a room of strangers, I do trust building games. Plus I act like a retard. LOL.

I also structure the storyline to make things comfortable for first time RPGers.

There is one more thing. If you dont want to do things in the
turtle mode then you need to communicate verbally. This one can be nasty. Chatting with American is easy, chatting with Scot or drunken Irishman is hard, chatting witch Englischman is extreme In difficulty.

You have never heard my Pakistani/Indian accents my friend, let me tell you. LOL Even I do not know what I am saying! Although the players with IT jobs will catch me. LOL!

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Native Speaker:
Well that is the best way to practice if someone has the time
and cash

Once upon a time there was an russian reality show. They took people to germany and let them tere to survive. So In such cases cash is not an issue ^_^

Native Speaker:
No, it does not depend on the people.

Little example maybe. Not so long ago i wanted to create a new playing theam. I have meet 2 people by Internet. When we discuss stuff about gamming sesion (In real life) only one was chatting, the second one stood still. I have asked this silent one to hear his opinion. And the answer i got? „My friend tells things better”.

Native Speaker:
Even a flower can be a challenge to some.

You can add me to this list :(

Marcin Barańczak:
In the end there would be two choices. You are learning englisch by committing an rpg session, or you play a session using not-very-englisch englisch

What i got In mind was that can be like scratching your back with a saw. You can do it but there are better and wiser choices. To fully play you need to comunicate flawlessly. If you can communicate perfectly, if you understand pun’s, you can express yourself but at the same time you do not need more practice. Interactive situations and stuff – good idea in my opinion because you are putted in different situations. But full – flaged session this is different story.

Native Speaker:
Although the players with IT jobs will catch me

Me be from IT branch :DMarcin Barańczak edytował(a) ten post dnia 20.08.08 o godzinie 14:01

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Marcin Barańczak:

Native Speaker:
Well that is the best way to practice if someone has the time
and cash

Once upon a time there was an russian reality show. They took
people to germany and let them tere to survive. So In such cases
cash is not an issue ^_^

Heh, that sounds like a show I would watch at least once.

Native Speaker:
No, it does not depend on the people.

Little example maybe. Not so long ago i wanted to create a new
playing theam. I have meet 2 people by Internet. When we discuss
stuff about gamming sesion (In real life) only one was chatting,
the second one stood still. I have asked this silent one to hear
his opinion. And the answer i got? „My friend tells things better”.

Yes, I understand. However, the perspective is different between tabletop RPG players and language students, who use tabletop RPG methods for practice.

Students want to save face when they speak. The masks allow that to happen. Keep in mind too that this type of practice is not for everyone. It is for proficiency level. Advanced students are permitted to participate if they are ambitious and a certain personality type.

Your "Silent Bob" from the Internet recalls my first time I playing AD&D in 1979. I was invited to play someone's Ranger character and had never even heard of the game before sitting at the table. I was listening and imagining but not participating. The moment I became a role player was when the DM suggested I use my rope to climb. (I did not know the rules let me do anything.) After a successful roll, I was hooked.

Marcin Barańczak:
In the end there would be two choices. You are learning englisch by committing an rpg session, or you play a session
using not-very-englisch englisch

What i got In mind was that can be like scratching your back with a saw. You can do it but there are better and wiser choices. To
fully play you need to comunicate flawlessly. If you can communicate perfectly, if you understand pun’s, you can express
yourself but at the same time you do not need more practice.

I tend to disagree here. Language is like a muscle: use it or lose it. People lose language at different rates - some quicker than others - but the law of regression applies.

When I used to teach at the fancy schools, the most frequent complaint from English natives was that they had regressed in vocabulary. This was caused by repeating over and over the same stuff/things, which dulls the mind IMHO. After a while, it is all so much stuff. Natives must be careful lest they arrive with a large functional vocabular and return with less than they had.

In another way, I have entirely lost my French through lack of use. I can still manoeuver through a simple conversation like a ungraceful, lumbering cow but no better.

There is a misconception that says: CPE and no more. It's a myth, a fantasy. Like an Orc.

Interactive situations and stuff – good idea in my opinion because you are putted in different situations. But full – flaged session this is different story.

A langauge practice that uses continuous role play (we call it a campaign, LOL) builds interest over time. It is a team building exercise - and used that way in business according to what I have read. It is an inviting improvisation where the beginner can save face and progress at the same time.

Native Speaker:
Although the players with IT jobs will catch me

Me be from IT branch :DMarcin Barańczak edytował(a) ten
post dnia 20.08.08 o godzinie 14:01

I have a rule at the table in-game where English is the only language allowed to be spoken or students pay a fine. I have to remind students that the rule says students pay the fine because my accented NPCs can barely speak Engrich sometimes. LOL

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

I thought I would give my opinion about Aneta's question, from the perspective of my language practices: why more Polish women than men play RPG?

Men, typically, play a more testosterone game than the women. Men gear up for battle and women tend to come with their boyfriends. I have had the pleasure to play a few games at both Paradox and Traffic and I observe that Polish RPGers are much the same as North American RPGers.

Since a "language practice RPG" can neither present opportunities for players to repeat "I attack!" every 20 minutes nor to simply practice the English words for an assortment of medieval weapons, the flavour of the game must be very different than the typical male RPGer is accustomed.

Simply put, the typical male RPGer does not like the style of game that must be tailor-made for English practice. Men might find this boring but women find this intriguing. Men are more inclined to a Lord of the Rings adventure, while women are more inclineed to explore a George R.R. Martin's Song of Fire and Ice world.

And World Exploration, Storytelling and Role Playing are much more in evidence in an RPG tailor-made (following the same planning as a lesson plan) for language practice.

You know, for those narrow-minded people talking "krypto reklama" about Aneta's topic here, it shows me how light in the pants people can be when they're talking out their ass. IMHO, of course.

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Hello,

First of all: why do we write in English here? If somebody already explained this, please accept my apologies -- I haven't read the thread carefully and may have omitted it.

Second: I'm not sure if the statistical information provided here is reliable. It may well be that the prevalence of women is just an accident. We would need to meet certain methodological criteria to be (more or less) sure.

Still, the data are interesting and I think it would be useful to compare them with the experience of academic teachers of English. I know at least one of them who uses RPG in his practice. Dr. Augustyn Surdyk (Adam Mickiewicz University, Poznań) has been writing on the subject over the last few years. I haven't read his works but I suppose they may be of interest to some of you.

Regards,
Staszek KrawczykStanisław Krawczyk edytował(a) ten post dnia 17.11.08 o godzinie 17:48

Temat: Why More Polish Women Than Men Play RPG?

Well, first of all, orc is not a myth!

Secundo: what I see is a failure to communicate...We are dealing here with 2 different worlds. One is hobby and the other is self-cultivation/self-mastery.
I myself play/roleplay/hack/slash/gm/execute/save/burn/robe/rape/sacrefice(myself and others) for over 15 years. And 've seen quite a few sessions. Women are rarity in pure joy/hobby segment of RPG. I never heard of learning or second language accquisition by rpg. What I imagine is that when it comes to learning more women are eager to master/muster their skills in language use - which is not the same as interest in rpg. Maybe they find it refreshing and a new fancy as well, but it's not the "love and fun" that is the heart of playing rpg.
To sum up: it's quite an interesting method to teach english but it's becoming more of a study and social sciences/exact science, apprenticeship even than experiencing "me thinks I see...with my minds eye".
Besides, rpg without fighting? Where else one can vent frustration of day to day life? Wher is the element when we detatch from reality?
And as a side note, most women I played with revealed their "true side/nature" - being more rapacious, predatorous, hungry for blood than medieval angry mob :P

Scuse my english...gramma and all, I was not so fortunate to attend to courses english schools and the like. I learned from MTV, Sky One and comic books :]