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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
Trainer, Translator,
Proofreader

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Kind of along similar lines to Rafał's thread on Mexico...

In La Paz, Bolivia, you can find a cocaine bar!

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/aug/19/bolivia-co...

Isn't cocaine technically illegal everywhere?

And one simple point: All drugs were legal until they were criminalized... Did criminalisation every stop drug consumption or make the world a better place?
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Tomek U.

Tomek U. finanse i kontroling

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Did criminalisation every stop drug consumption or make the world a better place?

Criminalisation prevented a number of people (those not so much determined to getting stoned) from taking drugs (maybe it prevented them from picking up a bad habit).

Criminalisation made it illegal and more difficult to make money on drugs production and distribution.

Did it all make a world a better place? no, but who'd knew, what it would be like if drugs had not been prohibited.
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Bernd Schreckenberg

Bernd Schreckenberg I am an experienced
teacher, with a
diverse background,
h...

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Where there is a demand, there is a market. Where there is a product and wits, a market gets created. Criminalizing or not, drugs will ever be used. Only the answer of how to deal with it may vary from society to society and from generation to generation.
Nor the extreme of allowing everything nor the extreme of forbidding everything will eventually be able to solve it...
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Lidia K.

Lidia K. +

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

yes, they've just discovered when they found him after a major search in Warsaw that the man who pushed the 19 year old girl under a bus with his car so eventually she died last night was on dope
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Rafał Wołk

Rafał Wołk I'm not arrogant,
you're just offended
by my confidence.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Tomek Usarek:
Did criminalisation every stop drug consumption or make the world a better place?

Criminalisation prevented a number of people (those not so much determined to getting stoned) from taking drugs (maybe it prevented them from picking up a bad habit).

Criminalisation made it illegal and more difficult to make money on drugs production and distribution.

Did it all make a world a better place? no, but who'd knew, what it would be like if drugs had not been prohibited.

Would you ever consider smoking crack, shooting dope or putting anything up your nose?
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Rafał Wołk

Rafał Wołk I'm not arrogant,
you're just offended
by my confidence.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Steve Jones:

by the way, you can still find places like that in Brooklyn.
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Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

I've ingested cocaine on two occasions just to see what is was like - the effects. I've never been interested in drugs from a recreational standpoint. But geez. I might as well have been sniffing laundry detergent. Or I'm permanently high. Dunno. I felt nothing. Nada.
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Tomek U.

Tomek U. finanse i kontroling

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Would you ever consider smoking crack, shooting dope or putting anything up your nose?

I would not.

But there are people who would, had it been easily accessible / available.
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Rafał Wołk

Rafał Wołk I'm not arrogant,
you're just offended
by my confidence.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Tomek Usarek:
Would you ever consider smoking crack, shooting dope or putting anything up your nose?

I would not.

But there are people who would, had it been easily accessible / available.

Following that logic we should ban anything that's dangerous. Knives could be used to kill people, by making them widely available we put millions in danger.
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Tomek U.

Tomek U. finanse i kontroling

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Rafal Wolk:
Tomek Usarek:
Would you ever consider smoking crack, shooting dope or putting anything up your nose?

I would not.

But there are people who would, had it been easily accessible / available.

Following that logic we should ban anything that's dangerous. Knives could be used to kill people, by making them widely available we put millions in danger.


Knives are usually used in a good way in everyday life.
I couldn't think of any good way of using crack/ cocaine/ heroine.
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Rafał Wołk

Rafał Wołk I'm not arrogant,
you're just offended
by my confidence.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Tomek Usarek:


Knives are usually used in a good way in everyday life.
I couldn't think of any good way of using crack/ cocaine/ heroine.

Usually being the key word.
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Steve Jones

Steve Jones Business English
Trainer, Translator,
Proofreader

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Crack cocaine/ heroin etc.. are very effective for getting you off your head. If you consider this to be "good", then by using them you are putting them to "good use". In the sense that you harm no one but yourself and get a little high in the process. If that floats your boat, then why not?

Personally, I wouldn't touch this kind of stuff because I value other things in life like taking care of my kids, running a business etc.

Most people use legal drugs such as alcohol "responsibly". Most people enjoy a casual drink and a bit of fun with friends. The fact that some people use it irresponsibly might not be a good enough reason to criminalise it.
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Bernd Schreckenberg

Bernd Schreckenberg I am an experienced
teacher, with a
diverse background,
h...

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Steve Jones:

Most people use legal drugs such as alcohol "responsibly". Most people enjoy a casual drink and a bit of fun with friends. The fact that some people use it irresponsibly might not be a good enough reason to criminalise it.

I haven't seen too many people using alcohol responsibly on Saturday. Actually, as an anecdote, it was quite freaky. When we got in the evening on the bus, the end was packed with hammered, beaten, scabbed, bloodied and passed out guys from young to old. That looked bizarre. The front of the bus contained the 'normal' people. ;)
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Tatiana Z.

Tatiana Z. CAO @ Kontomatik

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

So, similarly to knives, straws also should be banned because you can easily stick one into sb's eye.
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Lidia K.

Lidia K. +

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

You seem to overlook the fact that drugs are extremely addictive and probably all people who start taking them do it 'responsibly' in the beginning.
It's so hard to overcome physical addiction.
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Rafał Wołk

Rafał Wołk I'm not arrogant,
you're just offended
by my confidence.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Lidia K.:
You seem to overlook the fact that drugs are extremely addictive and probably all people who start taking them do it 'responsibly' in the beginning.
It's so hard to overcome physical addiction.

We should make alcohol and cigarettes illegal. I know that I've brought these numbers up before, but here they are again:

Annual causes of death in the US

Tobacco 435,000
Poor Diet and Physical Inactivity 365,000
Alcohol 85,000
Microbial Agents 75,000
Toxic Agents 55,000
Motor Vehicle Crashes 26,347
Adverse Reactions to Prescription Drugs 32,000
Suicide 30,622
Incidents Involving Firearms 29,000
Homicide 20,308
Sexual Behaviors 20,000
All Illicit Drug Use, Direct and Indirect 17,000
Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drugs Such As Aspirin 7,600
Marijuana 0Rafal Wolk edytował(a) ten post dnia 24.08.09 o godzinie 16:52
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Bernd Schreckenberg

Bernd Schreckenberg I am an experienced
teacher, with a
diverse background,
h...

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Rafal Wolk:
Lidia K.:
You seem to overlook the fact that drugs are extremely addictive and probably all people who start taking them do it 'responsibly' in the beginning.
It's so hard to overcome physical addiction.

We should make alcohol and cigarettes illegal. I know that I've brought these numbers up before, but here they are again:

Annual causes of death in the US

Tobacco 435,000
Poor Diet and Physical Inactivity 365,000
Alcohol 85,000
Microbial Agents 75,000
Toxic Agents 55,000
Motor Vehicle Crashes 26,347
Adverse Reactions to Prescription Drugs 32,000
Suicide 30,622
Incidents Involving Firearms 29,000
Homicide 20,308
Sexual Behaviors 20,000
All Illicit Drug Use, Direct and Indirect 17,000
Non-Steroidal Anti-Inflammatory Drugs Such As Aspirin 7,600
Marijuana 0

Drumroll..... Brrrrrrrrrrrbum:

The last number is an odd one!! Hahahaha!!!
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Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Me likey Raf's statistics. I always do. I'm not buying the tobacco-435,000-dead-marijuana-zero-deaths, though. High dose weed smokers develop pulmonary symptoms and lung functions get impaired, and large airway changes happen. The same long-term impacts in cigarette smokers that are related to the chronic obstructive pulmonary diseases may not be clear in a younger, daily marijuana user yet, but may manifest later on. It's just not clear, but in some toxicological sense, smoke is smoke.

Hemoglobin has about a 300 times greater affinity for binding with carbon monoxide than for oxygen. Cigarette smoke effectively steals food from cells. I don't know about marijuana smoke - but it can't exactly be fortifying (and those sheesh smokers who think they are smoking healthy? Pfff Uh...it's smoke , brutha).

Still, cannabis is an effective drug for treating nausea and vomitting in cancer patients, and it enhances appetites in people who have AIDS. It works for some glaucoma patients. Why there is any argument about using it in mainstream pharmacology is beyond me, no matter what the arguments are about collateral damage. I would advocate for anyone using it in spite of any local law governing it.

(In terms of addiction in recreational users, any drug that reduces anxiety or makes someone feel good can cause dependence. But I have never heard of anyone saying "God, help me stop smoking this weed." In fact, when someone is in a treatment program for marijuana use, it's usually because they have been ordered into it thanks to a positive test at work or whatever else. Personally, I have smoked maybe ten cigarettes in my life, marijuana, hash. I never crave marijuana, but sometimes I can sense a vague craving for a cigarette. That speaks to me about the addictive properties between the two. Other drugs are a different matter, in general, of course. The cocaine bar users and proprietors are begging for trouble).Joj Y. edytował(a) ten post dnia 25.08.09 o godzinie 19:55
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Rafał D.

Rafał D. Head of Production,
Locon Sp. z o.o.

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Just wanted to let you know Joj that it wasn't cocaine. ;)
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Bernd Schreckenberg

Bernd Schreckenberg I am an experienced
teacher, with a
diverse background,
h...

Temat: The World's First Cocaine Bar!

Not all drugs are good for you.

Some of them are great!!

:P
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